Ok straight up advice on cams

[jtrodreigez]

Hey fellas just been reading some back posts about cams so i hope i dont go over too much old shit, basically i want someone to spell it out to me what is worth buying and what to steer clear of. I find ry2d2's advice very good and i'd love a cannon xl1 off ebay for a grand but its a bit daunting as i havent made any shorts yet as im more of a writer.

are there any cams around 300 quid that are worth buying, and i mean i really dont want something that looks or sounds total shit as i may aswell just save up the grand and go for the cannon. I will be wanting to edit it on a lap top too.

One of the main things that grab me in a film are the cinematography and how everything looks so i need a cam that i am able to try and pull off shots like that with.

[Dazza]

From personal experience RyD22 advice is pretty spot on mate, I got a sony Handycam which is ok on picture quality but sound quality isnt too great as you hear a very faint whirl on everything as the tape is turning and the mike pics it up which I didnt notice until I think it was RyD22 pointed out and now I can notice it lol.

I am going to invest when I can afford it in a Cannon I think its XL1 or 2 or a Cannon XM2 which I think is the one RyD22 has mentioned before. The £300 camcorders are fine for beginner stuff but for your films to look and sound better you need a decent camcorder which comes at a price.

Also though I think its worth pointing out that the software u use for editing and how well u can use the editing software makes a hell of a difference, my editing is shite but a mate of mine uses the same camera as me but his editing is awesome and he makes films look the dogs bollox through his editing.

[Dave]

dazzab21 said:

I got a sony Handycam which is ok on picture quality but sound quality isnt too great as you hear a very faint whirl on everything as the tape is turning and the mike pics it up which I didnt notice until I think it was RyD22 pointed out and now I can notice it lol.

Remember that most handycams have an input for an external mic!

[jtrodreigez]

so i may sound like a moron but what specs am i looking out for on cheap (under 300) cams. I dont really understand much about specs so explain it as if i was 12 or something. Thanks.

[RydCook]

thanks for the praise about my advice!

i'd say if your gonna get a £300 camera, and your worried about camera, buzz whire.. what ever you wanna call it make sure the camera you have has an external mic port as dave mentioned, and buy yourself a decent external mic (i have no experiance with these so cant really advise) the only comprimise you will have to make with a £300 camera is picture quality. Everything will have a sort of.. home video look to it i guess, which (as dazzab21 said) you can change in the edit, but it has its limits, and this depends how good your editong software is. Another thing with £300 camcorders is the focus. it is certainly a task to do depth of feild and focus pulls with these cameras, its usually electronic (as a pose to handheld ring which is more precise) focus change, i know it is with canons, and its very hit and miss, so if this is in any of your scripts, note it is a task with these sort of cameras. other than that a £300 is certainly adaquate to make a good film, but you did say yuou are interested in cinematography, and a grand camera will give you the most freedom, and quality with this. I used a canon MV for all my films so far and they've worked out fine, but i thought of the films keeping in ind what camera i was using. whereas your scripts may need things like focus pulls, a better quality picture etc. i now have a canon XM2 and its perfect for me, as i use it for skate videos too (the handle at the top is perfect for it) but i would definately recommend an XL1 for just film makers.

at the end of the day if you think your scripts can be justified and look good with a £300 camera, go for it! you defintatly wont be dissapointed with the results.

but if you wan't that proffesional look of good picture quality, a good lens, focus pulls etc and this is essential for the films you wanna make, its worth saving up.

hope this all helps

[jtrodreigez]

Thanks a lot for all your advice but im just lost now, i think im gonna have to save up and go for the XL1 as ill just get pissed with the poor pic quality, saying this im sure if your any kind of film maker you can make something out of the cheaper cams. I think ill look through my scripts and see what i think i need.

Saying this though what is the point finding beautiful landscapes and scenery if it'll look shit when you watch it?

Anyone know of anything professional i will have seen that have been shot on any of the cameras we have talked about?

[Dazza]

28 Days later was shot on digital, I couldnt tell you which camera model though.

[Dazza]

Also if you want to see the quality a £300 camera produces (all though i got a brand new £300 cam off ebay for £160) click on the link to see some of the stuff I have made on one, it will at least give you an idea of what you can do with just the camera as my editing at the mo is crap.

I myself though am now aiming at getting something like the XL1 when I can afford one, but until then will ahve to continue with what I have.

livedigital.com/ACs81ADDAA/content/by_user/30629/

[RydCook]

28 days later was shot on XL1s.

If you've seen any of my work coyle, that was all filmed on £300 cameras, although its not professional! still gives you an idea of what stuff could look like. (theres other posts with links to them, Small Town although possibly the worst acted, has some nice landscape shots)

"Saying this though what is the point finding beautiful landscapes and scenery if it'll look shit when you watch it?"

you raise a good point, thing is great landscapes and scenery will look good on any camera, you thing you need to thing about is at what quality you want that landscape to look.. if you get me, how clear it will look. but i know what your saying, it all depends on how much you are willing to spend for the quality of picture.

[Dazza]

Hi RyD22 just a few quick questions, once I have managed to upgrade to something like the XL1 or XM2 myself can I use the camera in the same way I am currently using the Handycam will it just easily upload via USB and Firewire? Also what format are these kind of cams recording onto am I right to think they are still Digital tape? Last question can you plug in external mikes?

Thanks a lot

[RydCook]

yup easily upload just like you usually do with your camera now i should think, mostly likely through firewire, and usb for photos frpm the SD memory card. the format these cameras record onto is Mini Dv tapes, which are smaller than normal digital tapes, im not sure which ones you use at the moment. they're still just as easy to use. and yes they most certainly will have external mic ports.

[Dazza]

Excellent sounds like shouldnt be any problems then, I'm keeping my eyes open on ebay as well but they are all holding there prices well even second hand.

Thanks a lot

[jtrodreigez]

Right seems like im gonna wait for an XL 1 but i will get one eventually they seem dogs nackers. So my last question is what is the cheapest bag of shit cam i can get that will still give reasonable performance so i can learn on that for a year or so? If anyone can tell me things i will deffinately need in a cam then i know what to keep an eye out for on ebay.

Oh and dazza B i watch a couple of the shorts, nice stuff man.

[Hyde]

This is all helpin me out to. Thanks.

[Dazza]

Guys whilst like me your waiting to get a pro cam in the future, have a butchers on ebay and you will be able to get something you can use now to begin having some fun with.

I picked up a Sony TRV265E 2 months ago which was about £295 in the shop for a great deal at £160 brand spanking new with Sony warranty, etc. The only downside was that I dont think the model has an input for an external mike but u can get by for a beginners camera, I had a TRV245E before which was a bit better as it was older, heavier model and sat better on a Tripod. I found the handycam models great for a beginner filming as its nice and easy to use and can use night vision and shoot in widescreen, black and white if you like. You can get quite a few different sony handycam models and they more or less do the same.

From memory I think RyD22 also recomended a Cannon MV600i or a Cannon MV800i, I dont know the prices of these models but that might be another avenue to try as well.

My number one tip though when buying a model make sure its Digital 8 Tape or Mini DV and Not Hi8 tape, Hi8 camcorders are cheaper but don't have the USB connection to upload the video footage to your PC.

Also use a Tripod as you get a steadier shot than using handheld, all though I filmed the hitman film completely holding the camera without a tripod and that turned out ok.

If you find a camcorder on ebay and want a second opinion just shout and I'm sure we will be happy to help.